Forums > Offbeat > democrat vs republican .....again
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Forums > Offbeat > democrat vs republican .....again
Original message:85 days 12 hours 14 minutes ago
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Member: Johnny
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i dont intend to piss anybody off here, but i have to vent about this.

we all know that the election is big news right now, and its getting bigger every day now that convention time is here. i have been listening to my buddies here at work and it has reminded me of something that has always bothered me. there are SO MANY people who vote based strictly on party lines. they dont care who the candidate is. they will say anything to continue convincing themselves that a certain candidate is the best choice, even if they disagree with that candidate on a certain issue. i know alot of people who have been told all their life to vote for one party or the other because their parents were devoted to one party or the other. sometimes they dont even know the name of the person they have voted for. this really bothers me whether it is for a democrat or a republican. both sides are equally guilty of this sort of thing. i dont understand why we feel it is so important to label ourselves as one or the other. why cant we just be americans and leave it at that?

i have voted for candidates from both parties in the past, and i will probably continue to do so. if you tally it all up, i have voted for the democrat more often, but i still can not vote for them just for that reason alone.

i am not trying to ask your opinions on which side to vote for, im just wondering how everybody feels about the issue of dividing ourselves like this.
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Reply:85 days 12 hours 4 minutes ago
Member: jobabrinks
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In recent years, most candidates will reflect the ideology of their associated parties. In other words, Democrats are generally liberal and GOP generally conservative. So while individual candidates will vary in terms of their platform, in general most all Dems will be pro: abortion, gun control, environmental, raising taxes, and getting the hell out of Iraq. And most all GOP will be anti all of the above. I vote for the candidate's general ideology and his leadership ability. A lot of people vote on how the candidate will affect them directly. In other words, if one of the candidate's top platform issues is educational support, and the voter is a school teacher, he/she is likely to vote for a candidate regardless of party affiliation.
Reply:85 days 12 hours 3 minutes ago
Member: inablackout
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675
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how i see it

republicns: spend money lots of money

democrats: increase taxes lots of em

they are all crooked bastards. you just gott pick an evil you can live with. we've had 8 years of bush, are we really any better off thn we were 8 years ago...i don't think so. If anything worse. We are entrenched in the middle east, so much so we will be there for atleast another 5 years. the next leader of this country is in for a big shit sandwich. Imigration (illegal or legal) needs to be controlled and have more strict rules, i say that border to our south needs to be watched much more closely. There is so many issues that need to be addressed in this country.


Its gonna be messy
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Reply:85 days 11 hours 54 minutes ago
Member: dcunning30
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Johnny - it appears that you are part of the middle ground that both candidates will be trying to appeal to. You, and your vote have more powwer than you realize. Those committed to McCain are commit and they're not budging. Those committed to Obama are committed and they are not budging. But it is you who may swing either way and actually decide who gets elected.
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Reply:85 days 11 hours 54 minutes ago
Member: Hippieway
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To say I agree with one partys platform totally is not possible. The platforms are guidelines that cover a wide range of issues, that would require a commitment to party idealist that I can't manage. I have to go with the canidate (not the party) that makes the most sense to me on the issues locally or nationally depending on the office that is being contested. I try to take my obligation to the city, state, and country seriously and try to be an informed voter. To be honest that is not always the way it happens, but I do my best to vote outside of myself with the countrys interest first.
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Reply:85 days 11 hours 26 minutes ago
Member: Fred Kraus
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Me? I'm with you fellas'
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Reply:85 days 11 hours 19 minutes ago
Member: Xarkzila
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I don't vote for the candidate. It's who he can bring into office with him that really matters. The president is the one who sorts it all out, but if he's got morons running the different departments of the government, it doesn't matter how good he is.

It's unfortunate that we don't have a clue who will be appointed to any of these positions before the election, but we can examine the possibilities and I do.

Party politics. What a crock.

And the DNC in Denver makes us look like a little police state. Cops in full riot gear all over downtown. Automatic weapons in full view. You just expect one of them to walk up to you and demand to see your papers!

Yet, with all this security, my brother is working downtown at the Denver Center, which is where they're doing all the political interviews, and he just walks into the building, with his big black bag and while the secret service guys aren't really happy with it, it's the local guys who have a fit. He walked into one theater to breakdown the sound gear and the guy at the door, who's eyes suddenly became really big, stuttered out, "Oh, man.... You're carrying a big black bag! They don't like that!" He ignored the guy and asked, "When are they going to be done?" The guy started in on the bag again and he just looked at him and said, "I'll wait outside the door. Come get me when they've finished."

He did advise that the secret service guys aren't all that friendly, but he never got hassled.

That's top security! He said it's harder to walk into a rock concert than it is to get into the DNC.
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Reply:85 days 11 hours 4 minutes ago
Member: Johnny
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all of you are making good points.

i have a hard time getting my friends to understand the point i am trying to make. every time it is brought up, they try to convince me why i should vote for the party that they support. they are missing my point completely.

some people act like the democrats are the only ones who have ever done any good for the country, and the republicans have done all the bad.

some people act like the republicans have done everything good, and the democrats have done all the damage.

i simply refuse to agree with either of those statements. i can see good and bad on both sides.

one of my co-workers just told me that he has always voted for a democrat, and he always will until the day he dies. he doesnt care who the guy is, hes getting his vote because he is a democrat. he said that removing saddam from power in iraq was not right, that he was the best leader those people have ever had.

something tells me that he only says that because he knows that the republicans were in office when it took place. if a democratic white house had been responsible, im sure he would have agreed with it. to me that is just further proof of the extremes that some people are willing to go to, and i think it is a shame. just think how much stronger we could be if we didnt divide ourselves like that. we ALL are hurting because of a slow economy. we are ALL targets for terrorists who hate us because of our way of life. we ALL are affected by the lack of affordable health care, we ALL have to pay way too much for gasoline, we ALL have to live under the same laws.

i have been asking around, and i have found very few people who agree with one party or the other on every single issue, so why is our devotion to those parties so strong? it just doesnt make good sense to me.

we are all aware that the u.s. was once divided from north to south. some labeled themselves and confederates, and some remained part of the "united" states. look what we got out of that. a big fucking war where all of the casualties were american. i sure hope that doesnt happen again. we have got too much shit to worry about already without also fighting each other, whether it be diplomatically or by an actual physical fight.

look at the amount of money the two sides have spent trying to show each other up. imagine how much it would help if we focused all that attention on the good of all americans.
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Reply:85 days 10 hours 47 minutes ago
Member: jobabrinks
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I'm all for voting for candidates eschewing party affiliation. Unfortunately, with the way the two party system is constructed, presidential candidates need to conform to a certain ideology to earn their party's nomination. If you were to line up Clinton's and Obama's platform side by side (which I did) you wouldn't be able to tell them apart. Throw John Edwards in there too. On a local level, strictly adhering to the party's ideals is less pronounced. Of course, the way around this is to vote for a third party candidate, Green party. People don't do it because they are convinced that the votes will be wasted. Change always needs to start at the smallest levels...
Reply:85 days 10 hours 13 minutes ago
Member: Chester Field
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I vote for the person, have been doing so since 1968. Nothing will change this time around.
Reply:85 days 9 hours 28 minutes ago
Member: Fred Kraus
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How many of us would vote against term limits? It fairly obvious that 99.9% of Americans would vote for it, yet neither party seems to be able to get that one to pass. Why is that? I know the reason, I'm just wondering how they justify it. It's like that with so many things in Washington. I wonder what would happen if Americans, both Republicans and Democrats re-elected...nobody. If every singe person holding office who was up for re-election was thrown out, I wonder how the politicians who were not up for re-election would feel about that. I think they would be quite worried. Personally, I'd like to see that.
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Reply:85 days 7 hours 42 minutes ago
Member: Richey
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That would never happen because the candidates, their wives, families, and friends would all vote for their man. They would win 42-34 and get elected/re-elected. If they had no friends and family they would tie 1 to 1 because they would vote for themselves and then they would have to flip a coin. Nobody's going to stop this train from rolling without a revolution.
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Reply:85 days 9 hours 1 minutes ago
Member: Xarkzila
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Kind of like voting for judges. Since they're all "appointed" (at least in Colorado) we always have the "vote" to keep them in their position. I always vote NO. I didn't elect them in the first place so, NO, I don't want them to sit on their fat behinds and continue to collect my taxes in pay. Go kiss another ass to get appointed again. Nothing should be that permanent.
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Reply:85 days 7 hours 37 minutes ago
Member: Richey
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I don't think judges should be elected. Adjudicating the law should be based on fairness and principle and political ramifications should not be a component in a judges decisions on the law. A judge's obligation is to fairly apply the law to the cases that come before him. If a particularly unpopular criminal is tried in his courtroom, the political ramifications of that criminal being found innocent (despite public opinion) could (and probably would) affect an elected judge's decisions in that case in such a way that it reduces the fairness and impartiality of the defendant's trial thus denying him his constitutional right of a fair trial.
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